HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Hi Guys!
I want to buy a HCH II 2009 battery junction board for PB1-VB1xxxxx type battery (3 PTC connector in top of the battery )
Thanks

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Good luck. given that Honda extended the warranty on all 09-11 HCH2 batteries to 10 years/150K miles, most are still under warranty.


You need to check with salvage yards.

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Ouch.
Thanks a lot. Have you any information how to replace a XD type sticks to BVB or convert PB1 type pack to PA1?
I have a successfully regenerated PB1 pack without junction board. My HCH II has a PA1 type...
Chris

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

No idea. I don't know the pack designations. Physically speaking 06-08 are interchangeable and 09-11 are interchangeable. Different versions can require MCM programming, but I don't believe it's critical.


06-08 junction boards are only compatible with 06-08 packs
09-11 junction boards are only compatible with 09-11 packs.
06-08 subpacks are only compatible with 06-08 subpacks.
09-1 subpacks are only compatible with 09-11 subpacks.


Subpack stick spacing is different between 06-08 and 09-11, thus making intermixing of subpacks or use of other junction boards impossible.


I am aware of an 09-11 pack being installed in its entirety in an 06-08 car with no obvious issues. The issue with the pack was that it had at least 1-2 failed subpacks.


I would expect an 06-08 pack could be installed as-is in an 09-11 car.


First, what is a PB1 pack?
Second, what makes you think you've successfully regenerated it?

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gre...849bc29890.jpgPB1 in top and PA1 in bottom of picture
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gre...2f43366a41.jpgPB1 in the right side.
so this is the two different pack. Mostly the orthogonal plastik cups in the subpack is the different. Same capacity and dimensions. https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gre...e865ad593a.jpgXD type subpacks in PA1
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gre...4b9fe186d1.jpgand BVB type in PB1 packSo the 06-08 pack interchangeable with 09-11, but only with junction board. (Only few HCH II sold in Hungary, and i can not found in junkyard. )

I discharge each subpack to 9.6V and Charge to 6500mAh. I repeat this while can discharge 5300-5400mAh from each. Now after 3 weeks i measure 90.5+80V DC in two subpack strings.
I think, this is a successfully regenerating.

(sorry for my terrible English)

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

I don't completely follow you. Here is my understanding:


Pack with 3 dangling thermistor connectors is 06-08.
PB1 is 09-11.


09-11 sticks are same length, but distance between sticks in pair is more than 06-08.


9.6V is too low to discharge 12 NiMH cells.
Discharge to 13.2V for capacity.


Total pack voltage or sum of strings is zero value.


You need to check:
1) All 22 sticks - voltage of 1L and 2R, 2L and 2R, etc. They should be within 0.03V of each other.
2) Voltage of 11 subpacks should be within .06V of each other if very healthy (highest voltage - lowest voltage = 0.06V).


Even better... check ALL 132 CELLS. In the same stick/subpack, they should all be within 0.03V to be truly reliable.


Once you have confirmed the PB1 is healthy with above process, try Bumblebee Batteries. They might be willing to sell you one.

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Yes, you undersand me, the distance betwwen two stick is differ. (PB1 sticks has small rim at both ends)
The HCH II pack has 2 strings of subpack(it consists 5 and 6 subpack ), and the main battery switch connect this two strings to one pack.
The whole pack (sum of strings) is 170.5V DC at now.

I follow your instructions, and after I discharge and recharge with topping, measure all the cells . ( Because i did not use it for three weeks)
Thanks a lot, and i write to Bumblebee Batteries when finish the checking. (Maybee in weekend)

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Do not do any charge/discharge operations.


Take measurements now.


3 weeks is a great time to wait to take measurements. If they are good at 3 weeks, they will be VERY reliable.

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Ok. I measure in weekend.

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Once you get it running, get yourself 2X APC-35-350 and a 10A/12V power supply.


Build a grid charger with the APC power supplies in series (56-200V constant current) connected to the battery. Connect the 10A/12V supply to the IMA fan connector with the PWM wire shorted to (-), and you can drive the IMA fan while grid charging.


This will allow you to balance the battery every 3-6 months to keep it healthy. Once a year, you can use incandescent light bulbs to slowly discharge the pack and recover lost capacity.


Good luck,


Steve

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Thanks, I already designed a fan control with a little trick. Normally no High Voltage on charger connector, only when switched on the 12V from supply, and totally disconnect the Fan from vehicle's 12V, because the grid charger has automatically switch between 700mA and 300mA charging mode. ( below 150V DC, charge 700mA and topping at 300mA )
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gre...276d3dc335.pngIPU Fan driver

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

ah, then you are greatly more capable with electronics than I am.

I probably have more experience than you do with NiMH batteries. You can run 700mAh up to 185V with no problem. The pack's nominal voltage is 158V. It will always be higher than 158v if it has any charge in it at all. A completely discharged pack should go over 150V in seconds when charging at 700mA.

Pack should be cooled at all charge currents.

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Thank you,
I admit your knowledge in NiMH batteries. I prefer digital technology.
So You say, i run to 185V at 700mA and after switch to 350mA mode?
How much is its voltage when it is totally discharged? 132 or 145.2V (1 or 1.1 Volt / Cell) ? Can i use deep discharge? (0.8V / Cell)

Here is the charger's controller:
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.gre...79caaf4823.pngDual stage charger controller from
Mike Dabrowski's idea

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Ah... I see you used the 99mpg.com design as a basis. Good. IIRC, that design runs them both for 1050mA and then cuts out the 700mA to top off with 350mA. If you go with 1050mA, I would go to 187V before cutting to 350mA.


Yes. 700mA (or 1050mA) to 185V (187V) and then cut to 350mA. Peak voltage varies from pack to pack as well as temperature. 192-195V is typical, can be as high as 200V on a freshly reconditioned pack.


For grid charging purposes, terminate charge the sooner of 8800mAh input or peak voltage for 8 hours.


RESTING voltage of a completely discharge pack will typically be very near nominal, 158V. For reconditioning purposes, discharge to 158V at max current, 132V @ up to 500mA, 106V@ 300mA max.


Example:


1) Grid charge to sooner of peak voltage for 8 hours or 8800mAh input.
2) Discharge to 158V at maximum current you can use (typically 1-2A).
3) Discharge to 132V at 500mA max.
4) Discharge to 106V at 300mA max.
5) Repeat 1-3
6) Discharge to 66V at 300mA max.
7) Repeat 1-3 and 6 as needed.


If you record the times and currents in each phase, you can compute capacity and see any improvements.

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Yes. Mike's webpage is a good base.
This method same as the per stick reconditioning, but higher voltage and higher threshold voltages :) I finish my grid charger and maintain my original pack.

Thank you so much for the helping and instructions.

Chris.

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Mike did some amazing work. he's completely out of it now... IIRC, he has the Chevy Bolt pure EV now.


Good luck!


Steve

Re: HCH II 2009 Battery junction board wanted!
 

Wow pure EV... ! Mike is an amazing man! Very accurate and persistent.
So thank You again!

Chris